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  1. #31
    Site Sponsor sande005's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveMatthewsBand View Post
    I'll just say this, do some more research. There's plenty of evidence they last much longer than 3 years.
    And I don't know where you get your info, but these have never cost $1200. I paid $925 for mine last year.
    If you're content with your batteries, cool, stick with 'em.
    MidwestCamper was quoting the full price for 100Ah 12v GC2's shown on the BB website. You're quoting their "sale" price for their main line 100Ah 12v battery. 3 years was mentioned above. BB says 3,000 cycles, or about 10 years or more life. BB's web site does say the warranty is full repair/replacement for 8 years, and 30% discount in years 9 and 10. Interesting that besides all the expected exclusions for warranty coverage, they have one for freezing temps. And noted elsewhere was that recharging more than once a day is excessive...
    As you noted, it comes down to the advantages vs cost relationship and which variable fits better with each person's camping needs.
    2017 Imagine 2670MK
    2012 F-150 SCrew, Eco, 4x4 6.5 box
    Max. Tow, HD Payload, Airbags, ProPride hitch
    (Previous: Jayco 26.5RLS Fifth, Revolution Pinbox)

  2. #32
    King Pin
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    Quote Originally Posted by sande005 View Post
    MidwestCamper was quoting the full price for 100Ah 12v GC2's shown on the BB website. You're quoting their "sale" price for their main line 100Ah 12v battery. 3 years was mentioned above. BB says 3,000 cycles, or about 10 years or more life. BB's web site does say the warranty is full repair/replacement for 8 years, and 30% discount in years 9 and 10. Interesting that besides all the expected exclusions for warranty coverage, they have one for freezing temps. And noted elsewhere was that recharging more than once a day is excessive...
    As you noted, it comes down to the advantages vs cost relationship and which variable fits better with each person's camping needs.
    Help I'm so confused. LOL. I spent a little time on their website this afternoon and I'm getting conflicting info.

    1. I can't find the information you provide. e.g. The 30% discount at years 9&10 et.al.

    2. Their FAQ page states there is a three year warranty:


    3. Their warranty page states there is a 10 years warranty, but it doesn't define the caveat you stated about years 9 and 10.


    Based on some information I received a couple of weeks ago, I know they are expanding their warranty to 10 years. But evidently, the website hasn't been completely updated.

    Jim

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveMatthewsBand View Post
    I'll just say this, do some more research. There's plenty of evidence they last much longer than 3 years.
    And I don't know where you get your info, but these have never cost $1200. I paid $925 for mine last year.
    If you're content with your batteries, cool, stick with 'em.
    I've worked in the auto industry with hybrid applications off and on for years and may know a little bit about how those batteries are handled. They not only have a sophisticated battery management system but are also heated as well as cooled depending on the need. They are never permitted to be operated in a condition that would do them harm, unlike the drop in RV version. And this is why they are warranted for 10 years. If one were to take really good care of their drop in RV LiFeP04 to make sure all the same conditions are met, they may last 10 years. But its unlikely. I store all my batteries for hobbies at 50% charge in the basement in cool conditions. Not likely anyone will do this with an RV battery between trips. I'm interested in this technology and support its use and I would do it at the drop of a hat if their warranty covered me from an unforeseen defect for at least 5 years. No need to be defensive, where I support your choice. I choose to wait until someone offers up a reasonable warranty.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Dragonfly-Energy-Warranty.pdf  
    MidwestCamper

    Jim & Dawn
    Near Milford, Michigan
    2017 Imagine 2600RB
    2015 GMC Sierra 1500 Double Cab 4x4

  4. #34
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    Kia - mediocre performance, cheap, dependable.

    Ferrari - high performance, expensive, high maintenance, not so dependable, expensive to repair.


  5. #35
    Long Hauler DaveMatthewsBand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chiefblueman View Post
    Kia - mediocre performance, cheap, dependable.

    Ferrari - high performance, expensive, high maintenance, not so dependable, expensive to repair.

    Nice. I deserved that.
    Resistance is Not Futile, It's Voltage Divided by Current.


  6. #36
    Site Sponsor sande005's Avatar
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    I clicked on the GC2 battery, and then downloaded the warranty on that page, which is where I found the 8+2 year language, plus the exceptions for warranty coverage and "overuse" (my words).

    [Oops - later edit: Didn't see that MidWestCamper had already posted the downloadable warranty, so deleted part of this post that quoted sections of it]
    2017 Imagine 2670MK
    2012 F-150 SCrew, Eco, 4x4 6.5 box
    Max. Tow, HD Payload, Airbags, ProPride hitch
    (Previous: Jayco 26.5RLS Fifth, Revolution Pinbox)

  7. #37
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    Jim,

    Have you installed the 9160AL? if so how is it working.

    Did you just remove and replace the WFCO and use the same wiring to hook up the 9160AL.

    I Have some Lithium batteries myself and would love to install them in our 381.

    Stephen

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by TucsonJim View Post
    But it could result in catastrophic battery failure if you were to use a lithium charger on a lead/acid or AGM battery.
    When hooked to shore power yes---but when charging only via generator, the PD9160ALV sounds like the PERFECT charger for lead acids, since it doesn't immediately back off the bulk charge current, like all other converters seem to do. 14.6V is an ideal absorption voltage, at least in cool weather.

  9. #39
    Seasoned Camper
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    Very nice write up and excellent batteries of which we now have 7 of those puppies and very happy. One clarification or word of caution that needs to be made to clear, is where you say
    "Depending on the brand, you can use nearly all of the capacity of a LiFePo battery without damage. So on my 100 amp hour battery, I can use the full 100 amp hours and not damage the battery."
    Lithium batteries should not drop below 10% because once they reach bottom they are DEAD and have to buy new batteries. Many lithium battery users set 20% as a critical point to allow some margin of safety, but at 10% you need to cease using any loads and get to charging.
    Regards, Bruce, Lin An, Kenji & Suki (Our two Akitas)
    2019 Solitude 310GK-R
    2015 Ram 3500 Big Horn CC, TD, Aisin Tranny, DRW

  10. #40
    King Pin
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    Quote Originally Posted by BB&LAB View Post
    Very nice write up and excellent batteries of which we now have 7 of those puppies and very happy. One clarification or word of caution that needs to be made to clear, is where you say
    "Depending on the brand, you can use nearly all of the capacity of a LiFePo battery without damage. So on my 100 amp hour battery, I can use the full 100 amp hours and not damage the battery."
    Lithium batteries should not drop below 10% because once they reach bottom they are DEAD and have to buy new batteries. Many lithium battery users set 20% as a critical point to allow some margin of safety, but at 10% you need to cease using any loads and get to charging.
    Bruce - I don't know about other brands, but the battery management system on the Battle Born batteries will prevent damage from drawing them down too far.

    Jim

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