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  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by backtrack2015 View Post
    Fuel taxes have historically been one of the most popular forms of tax because people could see and understand the benefits immediately. The moment you use the tax for anything else, it becomes deeply unpopular (as it should). As a side note, I think we should refrain from partisan insults in our discussion here.
    What partisan insults? "Politicians" is generic. I don't think I've seen one post from anyone mentioning any political party.

  2. #52
    Site Sponsor Rapid1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigGuy82 View Post
    What partisan insults? "Politicians" is generic. I don't think I've seen one post from anyone mentioning any political party.
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  3. #53
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    I'm sorry. I stepped out for a bit. I was referring to the "sheep who couldn't read." I interpreted that as anyone who was in favor of keeping the fuel-tax in CA was a "sheep" who could not think for themselves. Forgive me if that was a misinterpretation.
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  4. #54
    Site Sponsor Gold Country Livin''s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by backtrack2015 View Post
    I'm sorry. I stepped out for a bit. I was referring to the "sheep who couldn't read." I interpreted that as anyone who was in favor of keeping the fuel-tax in CA was a "sheep" who could not think for themselves. Forgive me if that was a misinterpretation.
    Backtrack2015, No problem!
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  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigGuy82 View Post
    $39 billion sounds low, but that's OK. Now, take the number of vehicles on the road X registration fees, tolls (recently I spent $53 to cross just Indiana with my 5 axles), traffic ticket revenue, freight taxes (perhaps there is a trucker on here who can address that), state fuel taxes, etc. There is literally no way I would ever vote for somebody to increase the taxes on my vehicle even further, especially since I am paying almost 20% in taxes on just my fuel. As far as that $85 billion, the taxes I just mentioned should easily cover that and the best part is that the tab wouldn't be nearly so high if the government (state, federal, local)hadn't ignored the problem for decades. The point is that there is enough motorist money going into the pot to maintain the roads, so where is the rest going? Finally, in this day and age $85 billion is a mere drop in the bucket - take a few bucks out of social welfare, defense and mainly pork to just double that - who would notice?
    Stay on the main roads in Michigan as they are 80% gravel. I ask all the time where the road money goes here other than the gravel pits. Michigan is a fantastic state, but the roads here are mostly third world.
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  6. #56
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    According to the Tax Foundation the top five 2018 rankings of state imposed fuel taxes are (1). PA at 58.70 cents; (2) CA at 55.22 cents; (3) WA at 49.40 cents; (4) HI at 47.88 cents and (5) NY at 45.70 cents. Add an additional 18.40 cents for the federal tax.

    What was not clear in the rankings is if local sales tax were included in the state rankings. I know the counties in NY impose 8% (or more) sales tax on each gallon on gas. I’m sure other states do as well.
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  7. #57
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    As I read responses to this thread, I am picking up a definite pattern ... the roads/infrastructure in America is failing badly and it seems like the money that motorists spend in vehicle related taxes is being spent elsewhere. Shocking!!!

  8. #58
    Rolling Along backtrack2015's Avatar
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    The American Road and Transportation Builders Association has some interesting statistics (with references) on their FAQ page. https://www.artba.org/about/faq/ The discussion includes funding levels, amounts typically allocated to various projects, statistics about total numbers of miles of various roadway types in the country, info about states with the worst/best roads/bridges, and a lot of other interesting stuff. While I don't trust politicians any farther than I can throw them, I personally think the scale of the problem here more than matches the scale of the funding.
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  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by backtrack2015 View Post
    I personally think the scale of the problem here more than matches the scale of the funding.
    And how did the scale of the problem get so huge? I think the roads got this way because they have been neglected for years and because the funding for roads was and is being used for non-road social programs. The answer always seems to be "more taxes" ... then those "earmarked taxes" are squandered on other than what they are intended for, so that later on they can say "we need more taxes to address this problem". Listen to The Temptations Ball of Confusion ... "and more taxes will solve everything". As Margaret Thatcher said - "pretty soon, you run out of other peoples money". As I said "we have lousy roads in the worlds most prosperous country because we have neglected them for years".

    The argument that we are underfunding road maitenance just doesn't hold water with me.

  10. #60
    Rolling Along backtrack2015's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigGuy82 View Post
    And how did the scale of the problem get so huge? I think the roads got this way because they have been neglected for years and because the funding for roads was and is being used for non-road social programs. The answer always seems to be "more taxes" ... then those "earmarked taxes" are squandered on other than what they are intended for, so that later on they can say "we need more taxes to address this problem". Listen to The Temptations Ball of Confusion ... "and more taxes will solve everything". As Margaret Thatcher said - "pretty soon, you run out of other peoples money". As I said "we have lousy roads in the worlds most prosperous country because we have neglected them for years".

    The argument that we are underfunding road maitenance just doesn't hold water with me.
    Federal fuel-tax money is not spent on social programs. It is quite the opposite, with general funds going toward the highways. NY or CA may well divert state fuel taxes, registration fees, etc to social programs as you suspect. I've not bothered reading about individual states. What does NY do with the fuel-tax money it collects?
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